why would Jordanians want to go the iraqi resistance route? what’s there to resist?

security forces are there to maintain the security of mainly external threats. so what does that have to do with anything you’re talking about.

why would the average jordanian want to revolt? against what? american occupation? israeli occupation? tyranny and brutality?

do you even live on a jordanian street?

lastly, please do not throw insults at me or anyone else commenting on this blog. them is the rules.

thanks

p.s. those were all rhetorical questions.

Nas, What a silly comment. Not even the USA with all its might can put an end to the bloody violence in Iraq. Do you really believe if Jordanians want to go the Iraqi resistance rout that ANYONE can stop them?

GET REAL!

So if I were you, I would go down the street and kiss the ass of the first average Jordanian you find and beg forgiveness for your insolence.

Not the King and not his special forces and not the whole of Jordan’s army can do a damn thing if Jordanians want to take matters into their own hand. Again, just look at Iraq and count your blessings that Jordanians, so far, have been wise and peaceful. And if you think for a moment that this is a result of fear of the security forces, than you are a world class moron.

Yes, it does help people who served their country well, and many of them can’t afford Uni, and therefore poor. I know of several poor families that couldn’t have afforded University if it wasn’t for the makruma. I don’t see the reason for the envious attitude towards the makruma, I never got one, but I’m pleased for all those who got one. It’s for a good cause, whether you like it or not.

I’m merely just a pacifist Jordanian who believes in peace, democracy, and justice for all. Call me a dreamer if you want. But don’t call me a Zionist. Come on, we should be able to debate in a more civil manner. If you are a Jordanian, I want to say this, I love you. You’re from my blood, my country, and I’d live and die for you. We may have different opinions, and I respect you for it, but please, don’t let it be a dagger of hatred between us. Please accept my apologies if you were insulted in anyway, I didn’t mean any insult. But I will not apologise for what I believe in.

I know. people like you.

“Apparently, logic, fact-seeking, and sensible thinking is frowned upon.”

When you frame of reference is Zionism and pure self-interest, your logic and facts will not sync with those who are on the receiving end of your hate, selfishness, and violence. But no doubt you will welcome those who support your agenda. And yes, there are Arab Zionists.

“Makrumas DO help many poor Jordanians get the university education”

please don’t say something we all know to be untrue. they go to only one kind of poor Jordanians.

PS if you are Jordanian, I am Martian.

I may not have the time or enough knowledge and experience to speak about the matter as much as Nas, but if only you people would listen to him, then perhaps you can think straight. Problem with our communities is that those people who reject ‘American and Jewish’ propoganda, as they call it, often resort to believing ‘pan-Arabic and Islamoextremist’ propoganda, and frankly, I don’t know what’s worse. I can’t believe people can’t find a reasonable middle grounds to stand on, it’s either this or that. Apparently, logic, fact-seeking, and sensible thinking is frowned upon.

Point is - we’re way better off this way, God protect ‘the regime’ as you call it, and God protect all of us. Makrumas DO help many poor Jordanians get the university education they deserve, you have no point there.

As for that so-called ‘rj’, I wouldn’t trade my Jordanian citizenship for the world! Where is your sense of belonging to Jordan? The only reason behind our strength is our unity, under the crown, and most importantly, under God. That is what makes us Jordanian, and these are our Jordanian values. If there is one thing people should wake up from, it’s the islamofacist propoganda promoted by the likes of Al-Qaeda. Our economy has always been bad, we don’t have any resources. We always had to live of foreign aid, answer this question then. Where was the aid from other Arabic countries when King Hussien asked for it?

your thick skull is yours to bear

Attention Jordanian citizens, according to Nas, you have no say in decisions by the regime that will put you and your loved ones in harm’s way. If you do voice concern, you are an Al-Qaeda member.

lol yeah patronizing me is going to help prove your point, i’m sure. the middle class has been comparatively growing in the past years, it has simply been offset by the growing poor and the growing rich. or in other words stuck in the middle of expanding polarities of wealth on either end which in turn has also expanded the middle, where those once considered poor are now better off and those once considered rich now considered middle. the rapid migration from the east to the west of amman and its consequent housing expansion is merely one indication of that. and as low as it is, there is more investment now then ever before. more jobs now then ever before. despite regional inflation, there is more consumption and more production now then ever before.

but i guess if your definition of middle class is limited to middle class america, then i can see how you get your numbers.

(you see how silly patronizing can be?)

“itâ??s all part of the Talking Points and you are doing a fine job.”

sigh…when they have no point they resort to throwing mud.

“I think most tend to believe the bombings were revenge attacks”

ah..so now the argument becomes we support al-queda because we don’t support our government policies. or in other words, the government is responsible for people who choose to strap bombs to their bodies and detonate themselves in a wedding.

brilliant

the alqueda talking points

even more bone-chilling

I think most tend to believe the bombings were revenge attacks and not as some suggest politically motivated. the regime’s does america’s dirty work in iraq, Jordanians suffer “blow back”. this is what Bush meant by saying taking the war on terror to the enemy or (my addition) idiotic sidekick regimes who are willing to put their citizens in harm’s way in return for an American makruma.

others look at the “demographic” mix of the victims of the bombings and they arrive at bone-chilling conclusions.

no matter how you look at it, the whole thing stinks to high heavens.

Are you sure we live in the same Jordan?

official reports and UN reports put the average Jordanian monthly income at about 200 USD. I fail to see the truth behind the “fastest growing middle class in its history.” these are official reports, not Amnesty reports. But I guess if you samples are limited to Abdoun, then I can see how you get your numbers.

this is exactly what someone said earlier about “jordan’s economy is booming and Jordanians are rich”

it’s all part of the Talking Points and you are doing a fine job.

ah some one with a sense of humor. i don’t know why you can afford it.

“Donâ??t flatter yourselves. This is gulf money and western eduction PAID FOR BY PARENTS WHO WORKED TWO JOBS 16 HOURS/DAY. No Makrumas for us buddy, even though poeple like us form 90% of the tax revenues.”

so these are the people who live in the gutter in jordan? or as someone said before “the trenches”. the elitists?

which begs the question that if the regime is so bad because of the elitists, then why are you sticking up for the elitists?

or no, wait, the elitists are good as long as they wernt in jordan when they became elitists…

“Nas, you did not have to go through the Official Talking Points. We know them all by heart. i think at this point people had made up their minds and know the answers to all of the TPs. And this is the debate of the deaf.”

it’s strange how you seem to personify the exact description of the model in my post. as a jordanian who cares about the stability of my country i am automatically deemed ignorant and a parrot of the regime simply for defending our security forces and their apprehension of a common threat. because you can’t be a free thinker if you follow talking points right? hence I belong to a society that has individuals that believe everyone who does not attack the regime is not as enlightened as they are.

“I am not against Makrumas by the way. I just wish my best friend who got 97% got to study what he wanted. So not only did he not get a Mukruma, which was expected. He was denied entry into his favorite major, a life-long dream denied.

And now I understand why this happened to him. Makrumas are pay-offs So the regime can have people who will defend it, for bad or for worse. ”

I have no liking for makrumas but it’s also strange how we went from talking about security and stability into a discussion about makrumas which have no basis in this conversation. I don’t like makrumas but i dont believe they are pay-offs, they are considered a perk for people who have served with public service. a negative perk, but nonetheless.

“So to add to the above commentators, not only does the regime screw the poor and adds to their ranks, they screw the middleclass and those who contribute to the regime coffers and its minions. ”

while the region falls apart all around us, the country is seeing the fastest growing middle class in its history.

in any case

makrumas and ‘why-i-hate-the-regime’ rhetoric aside…again this is a post about what people choose to believe instead of what is really there. the fact that there are those who firmly believe the amman bombings were a fabrication is a very scary thought as a jordanian citizen. the fact that there are those who are in favor of the extremist militants ideology and objectives with regards to the sovereignty and stability of this nation is also a very scary thought.

Don’t flatter yourselves. This is gulf money and western eduction PAID FOR BY PARENTS WHO WORKED TWO JOBS 16 HOURS/DAY. No Makrumas for us buddy, even though poeple like us form 90% of the tax revenues.

Nas, you did not have to go through the Official Talking Points. We know them all by heart. i think at this point people had made up their minds and know the answers to all of the TPs. And this is the debate of the deaf.

I am not against Makrumas by the way. I just wish my best friend who got 97% got to study what he wanted. So not only did he not get a Mukruma, which was expected. He was denied entry into his favorite major, a life-long dream denied.

And now I understand why this happened to him. Makrumas are pay-offs So the regime can have people who will defend it, for bad or for worse.

So to add to the above commentators, not only does the regime screw the poor and adds to their ranks, they screw the middleclass and those who contribute to the regime coffers and its minions.

But I see it as Sadaqa and hope god will reward his family in the after life.

So the Jordanian regime is anti-hamas even though most if not all Hamas members carry Jordanian passports, which is the only way they’re allowed to travel. In return their syrian militant wing plans it’s own plots and stores its own weapons on Jordanian soil, with mind you, Khaled Mishal recently renewing his passport and getting approval for it.

So the Jordanian regime is anti-shi3a and pro-sectarian violence in Iraq, when it seems to be the only arab regime warning against sectarian violence and asking iraqis to unite, all the while accepting well over 3,000 Iraqis a day into the country, shiites, sunnies, pro-saddam, anti-saddam, ex-baathists and pro-malkis…totalling around a million in the last 3 years. encouraging sectarian violence in iraq, aka civil war, is one of the biggest variables of instability this country could face, why would it encourage it. people who make this claim will also accuse jordan of following america’s foreign agenda, while america has no interesting in inciting greater sectarian violence as it only encourages its own failures there. in other words its a contradiction to make both those claims at the very same time.

And since when has the monarchy been the richest in the world? some ones been reading the arab times too much. It is one of the poorest. Arafat and Castro had more money than this regime. so let’s get some perspective.

We change ministries by removing the ineffecient ones…that’s actually a good thing.

And it’s funny that anyone whose anti-regime, specifically for its pro-american agenda, seems to also be pro-american citizenship. But hey, if the anti-regime guys are all living in the trenches in jordan, yet still can afford and even have access to the internet, in addition to a decent enough education that allows them to speak in semi-full and semi-complete sentences, then maybe we’re not doing so bad.

as for jordanians being the only people responsible for the regime’s stability, i agree. our security forces are all made up of Jordanians, so I agree with that conclusion wholeheartedly.

as for division. the most negative anti-anyone-who’s-not-like-me rhetoric has comes from the lips of the everyday jordanian on the street.

forget about pro-regime and anti-regime…those who hate it so much have the option of leaving…but as jordanians…as people who have the best interest of jordan at heart…i think we can all get on board with the extremist militants that seek to destabilize our homes and our nation.

if we can’t do that….then we have a bigger problem on our hands than i thought.

And yeah, ‘incompetent foreign policy’, thank you, I needed a laugh.

as for the claiming the regime is a pillar of Jordan’s stability, I BEG TO FU&*$# DIFFER.

the regime waged an expansive and persistent campaign, the direction of the white house, to fan the flames of sectarian and provincial hatreds (sunni vs shitie and jordan vs hamas) but because Jordanians are wise and well-informed, all of the regime’s hate-mongering campaigns failed miserably. and I pray that Jordanians continue to be vigilant in the face of the regime’s vicious attempts to divide arabs and muslims.

Only Jordanians can take credit for Jordan’s stability. AND DON’T YOU EVER FORGET THIS.

Allah Yestur.

Few days ago, the US raided the Iranian consulate in iraq and found “evidence” showing plans to bomb sunni targets.

roll back time…

Jordanian authorities found evidence to show Hamas planed to bomb strategic targets in jordan and to assassinate prominent Jordanians. i have no doubt if the alleged Hamas guys resisted and if there were no political costs, they would have been shot too. this discovery was made soon as Hamas was slated to make the rounds in the arab world after its decicive electoral victory.

Then you have the Irbid story..

It could be true, but there are more reasons to doubt than to go along.

the problems with the official arab propaganda is that they take arabs for fools. and their spins are too darn thick and unoriginal, and their enemies are not the arabs’ enemies and their friends are not the arabs’ friends.

there is a total breakdown of trust.

as for conspiracy theories, I guess in some sense Jordanians are like Americans. Iraq was invaded based on some outragous consipiricy theory of WMD and Alqaeda links. Today, every attack in Iraq or Afghanistan or Somalia is blamed on “foreginers” , code words for Syrians and Iranians at times or Al-Qaeda and Bathists at others) . No proof is needed, but one can be fabricated by the same people who presented the world with the incontrovertible evidence needed to destroy Iraq.

so I guess it’s natural for people to want to stick it to the bad guy. And I guess considering the 0 trust between authoritarian regimes and their people, it seems the official propaganda is really only geared at pleasing the Americans, since it’s a given that most Jordanians don’t really by this crap.

there was no hamas debacle, that issue was crystal clear. hamas had weapons on jordanian soil which is against the law. they were offered two opportunities to review the evidence and they refused.

and i dont remember a “jordanians are rich” campaign”

is there really a US Pentagon Propaganda Office in Jordan? is it next to the Ministry of Truth?

lastly, in case you missed it, my question was not ‘why people don’t believe’ but rather what they choose to believe instead